In a previous life I must have been an orange because I am forever being asked to spout on about that colour. In relation to wine! It is a topic that I enjoy talking about, for it allows me to adopt a “three dimensional” approach to the subject, so to speak – rambling through the highways and byways of philosophy, music, art, culture and memory and fleshing out the journey of how the wines came to be and what significance they may have for us. Talking discursively in this way is like abstract painting, with ideas layered on top of one another. The discourse seems unformulated and digressive initially but attains rough shape eventually. The truth, of course, is never simple.
The world of wine in itself may be fascinating, yet talking about it can be reductive in the extreme. Reciting lists of facts and figures as a means of disseminating information is to disengage from the very spirit of the liquid that we seek to enthuse people about.
Podcasts are very useful for contributors and listeners alike in that they are akin to dropping into the local pub for a friendly chat. Or eavesdropping on an interesting conversation. Once, as a guest on Radio 4, my synapses froze under the pressure of a strict programme format that required concision, urbanity and disarming knowledgeability. Reader, with the producer gesticulating, the studio clock ticking relentlessly, I semi-flunked it and became a squeaky babbling parody of a Radio 4 wannabe guest. But in the bar afterwards, with the other guests from the programme, I was undammed.
In a previous life I must have been an orange because I am forever being asked to spout on about that colour.
With the right interviewer, wine is a fun subject to natter about. Because the podcast format is more relaxed and time is on one’s side, there is no requirement to oversimplify. You can flub your lines even. If a rabbit hole appears, it is permissible to dive down into it temporarily. To quote Laurence Sterne: ““Digressions, incontestably, are the sunshine, the life, the soul of reading! Take them out and one cold eternal winter would reign in every page. Restore them to the writer – he steps forth like a bridegroom, bids them all-hail, brings in variety and forbids the appetite to fail.”
Recently, Janina Doyle of eatsleepwinerepeat kindly invited me to blether on her podcast. We covered two separate topics: Orange and Natural Wine (the first podcast) and The History of Oregon Wines. These were not so much the official titles as much as the launchpads for discussion. Both casts featured wines that Janina could taste and review. Witnessing her response showed me that even when not tasting, you can be struck by (and appreciate) another person’s spontaneous surprise and enjoyment. It brings a whole extra dimension to the wines being talked about.
Podcasts are very useful for contributors and listeners alike in that they are akin to dropping into the local pub for a friendly chat. Or eavesdropping on an interesting conversation.
Yakking about orange & natty wines is now second nature to me. The opening foray usually involves defining one’s terms. I like to keep any definitions purposely vague to demonstrate a kind of intellectual open-mindedness. An audience will inevitably prefer pat definitions and easy answers to wider questions, but it is worth understanding why someone (me, in this case) who expressly prefers drinking natural wines, chooses to do so. The reasons are not always tangible – or logical. They are personal.
With orange wines, a show and tell works very well. The warm colours of these wines are striking, can be beautiful even, and is certain to conjure powerful images for the listener (or watcher). Discussions about the colour of a wine take us into less familiar areas such as our feelings and expectations about what a wine should look and taste like and how orange wines have begun to confound those expectations.
The second podcast featured an overview of Oregon wines. I began by mentioning the first vines planted in the State way back in the 19th century, skated through the Prohibition era and how it throttled local wine culture, and emerged into the early 1960s when Richard Sommer planted vines and made wine in the Umpqua Valley and referenced David Lett and Charles Coury as being in the vanguard of wine pioneers. Oregon then burst into world wine awareness as a result of Lett’s Eyrie Reserve Pinot Noir finishing ahead of so many Burgundies in a Gault-Millau World Tasting in the 1970s.
The rest is fairly recent history. A tiny handful of wineries in the early 1970s has since grown into a thousand + facilities, and Oregon has continued to garner critical acclaim for its wines throughout the world, particularly its Pinot Noirs. I touched on terroirs, the various AVAs (so difficult to keep up), climate change, grape varieties and changing winemaking methods. Whereas the orange x natty wine podcast was mainly opinion, the Oregon counterpart involved pumping out a lot of facts and figures (or as many as I could recall!). Wine education takes in all sorts. In an ideal world, I would love to open minds and show that what is in the glass is the culmination of a long process, and also that our response to the liquid itself is very much about how we perceive things, our prior knowledge, our prejudices, and our shifting tastes. But understanding the history of wine in a particular region is an oft neglected part of wine appreciation. It gives us a context for what we are tasting.
I have recently written about how podcasts have become the best way to engage with a subject that one is interested in.
I asked Janina Doyle for her thoughts about podcasting, the rationale behind this medium of communication, and her distinctive approach.
“I am now finishing off my 4th season of the Eat Sleep Wine Repeat podcast, and I truly believe podcasts are now one of the best mediums for communication for several reasons.
With new statistics coming out all the time telling us we have only a few seconds attention span now, having on-demand listening where listeners can tune in whenever it works for them, and listen/learn whilst multi tasting (doing the house work, going for a run, the train commute), this to me is the go to channel for entertainment.
Equally podcasts are the ideal place for storytelling, marketing, brand building and education. You really have the ability to build up personal connections with your audience, what with the conversational style, and so you can build a sense of community among listeners and so I get to educate, which is something that I love, but equally do it in a more personal and impactful way.
This also means it’s so much more beneficial for the guests coming onto the episode. They want to get their message across, and they know that those listening are highly engaged.
There is also something quite exciting about the ability to reach people on the other side of the world. I love looking at my statistics and wondering, who is the person listening to this podcast in Sierra Leone, or in Bosnia and Herzegovina? Nearly 70% of my listeners are between UK, USA, Australia and then Canada, which makes sense what with the fact I’m speaking English and talking about wines that are most likely to be available in those countries. But 20% is across Europe and I think that comes from the fact that I keep all the topics varied.
I try to make sure that each episode has a very specific theme, so a listener knows what they are going to get before they listen. Typically I focus on a wine region so the audience can get to know it better. It’s important to me to find guests of authority as they need to have either visited this region, so they can offer advice for a wine trip, or be their specialist wine region so they can offer insiders knowledge that you can’t just google. But it’s important to tell the story of each guest, as I want the listener to also understand how we have all got into the industry, as the wine world is certainly not a traditional one, and this might inspire them to do the same. Most importantly I try to mix things up. I don’t want the podcast to ever be too serious, as wine is NOT serious, but I want some episodes to be a little bit more of a deep dive, and others to be a little softer, playing around with food pairings or talking about wine gadgets etc. So I hope that I find the balance between terroir talk and dining table wine tips. I think it’s working as when my audience contacts me, I find out I have a range of avid wine lovers, all the way up to WSET diploma students. So I must be doing something right!”